The New Mexico Independent - Latest Comments in The problem with hate speech

Re: The problem with hate speech

Thomas_James — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 13:28:59 -0000

Ok I refuse to waste any more time on your nativity. I will say this have you ever seen the donor lists for groups such as Earth First. IF you haven't perhaps you should.

And can you say Manny Aragon......

Your blind, spoon-fed partisanship is sad.

Re: The problem with hate speech

anchorite — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 12:47:01 -0000

1. One documentary (a genre that is not a moneymaker) that funds one group is not much. If you want to talk about right-wing Hollywood, talk about the hundreds in millions of money that have gone the other way, that conservatives have put into movies, like Red Scorpion, or Cannon Films, as political propaganda against Muslims or Nelson Mandela's ANC. That's hate in Hollywood, and we've been seeing dozens of films over the last 30 years funded by that same crowd.

2. I haven't heard Pelosi say any such thing. And I don't even believe she would. In my view she's pretty conservative. Liberals would not tour Bush's black prisons in Europe and stay silent. Liberals who do use hate speech are in a tiny minority, while just this week we've seen mainstreamers on the GOP side like Palin say that blue states are anti-America. A sitting congressman said that liberals hate Christians and Americans (as if liberals are not all American Christians to begin with).

The democratic abandons its values often. It abandoned them and supported segregation, supported censorship, supported communist witch hunts, has been the strongest party supporter of apartheid Israel, supports free trade over labor, and for those reasons and more I'm not a democrat anymore, haven't been for a long time. But I wouldn't say they are corrupt because it's the GOP that is in there starting giant wars just to enrich their friends, illegally trying to keep the poor and minorities from voting by lying and saying that people who are foreclosed upon are not registered to vote anymore, people with the same name as a convict (and who hasn't?) are to be unregistered, they use campaign funds illegally like Tom DeLay and Jack Abramoff, and they fire subordinates who don't agree with them even though they are doing their jobs, like David Iglesias, and even Colin Powell was basically fired for not toe-ing the line. That's corruption.

Re: The problem with hate speech

Thomas_James — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 10:36:52 -0000

1. No the earth firsters are funded by a another big industry the movie industry, which sells billions annually in the form on nonessentials like $10 movie tickets.

2. Yes, plenty of democrats say stuff like that to large crowds all the time, have you ever listened to any of the Pelosi, Reid, Kari, crowd speak.....that is their liberal democrat mantra.

Are you really that naive? Why do you insist on defending corrupt parties?

If Price really wanted to urge tolerance, maybe he should have admonished both sides! But ol V.B.'s real goal was to incite more partisan hatred. Why else would spend a whole column bashing one side, when both are guilty and then get to the bottom to say "Now play nice everybody."

Re: The problem with hate speech

anchorite — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 18:24:06 -0000

Earth Firsters are nowhere near as well funded as a group that gets its money from members with thousands of dollars to spend on non-essentials like $1000 M-16's and $8,000 G3's. I've never heard of a single Earth First member ever being elected to public office or being appointed to anything. Plenty of NRA members are federal officials.

Today from a sitting Congressman we have heard, "Liberals hate real Americans that work and achieve and believe in God." Have any Democratic Congressman said that conservatives hate the poor? Hate the environment? Hate Mexicans? Hate immigrants? I know you think that is what liberals believe, but although we get frustrated with what we see as destructive behavior, we don't tell a crowd, "These people hate you, they don't deserve to be treated like Americans." This kind of speech is just so out of line compared to what democrats have said, and it's certainly out of line compared to the tolerance that Price is urging.

Re: The problem with hate speech

Thomas_James — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 13:44:39 -0000

There are plenty of conservative groups that stand up for civil rights. The Cato Institute, the Pacific Legal Foundation and several others. Earth Firsters are about like the NRA, well funded and able to fend for themselves so why does the ACLU support them and not NRA causes??????

And your point was that hate speech is limited to fringe types like Farrakan, but as examples of the GOP as whole you cited fringe types like Rush and Dr. Laura. I think if you really want to use a broad brush to characterize a party, you should be honest. BOTH parties are full of fringe types that express hate speech. I suppose you could to a head count, but the fact of the a matter is they both suck. And defending either of them with more divisive partisanship like VB promulgated here or you defend only does more disservice to this Country by adding fuel for the two way race to the bottom!

Re: The problem with hate speech

anchorite — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 10:36:34 -0000

I don't hear people on Air America Radio calling those who disagree with them traitors and cowards on a daily basis like I hear "Dr." Laura, Rush Limbaugh, and Jim Villanucci calling pacifists on 770 AM. I sort of take exception to being accused of a crime punishable by death because I don't agree with someone's attempt to subjugate a slew of Muslim countries to enrich the President's circle of friends. Just a bit.

Your point about the ACLU is taken but doesn't mean anything. The ACLU doesn't spend any time and resources on the second amendment that I know of, especially since the NRA does that just fine, so maybe they are the AC(L-1)U, but it doesn't diminish their record of defending police, conservatives, Republicans, and even hate group members when all they do is exercise their right to free speech, including hateful speech. When have any conservative groups defended Earth Firsters or university professors?

Re: The problem with hate speech

Thomas_James — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 09:52:26 -0000

I have to call BS. Hate speech is not limited in the slightest to the GOP, that is pure sophistry on your part.

The problem with the ACLU is their selective choosing of which Constitutional rights they are willing to back up, not that they defend free speech.

Apparently YOU are the one that doesn't get it.

Enough with Democrat or Republican partisan rhetoric, YOUR trying to defend it just proves the point.

Re: The problem with hate speech

anchorite — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 00:41:48 -0000

Sadly, hate speech pretty much IS limited to the GOP with the exception of a few fringe types like Farrakhan, although Republicans don't consider it hateful to call for the slaughter of foreigners who've never wronged us, such as the 1,600,000 Iraqis who've died by our foreign policies and attacks since 1991 who were NOT Saddam Hussein or in his employ.

As for partisanship, Price was just calling for the tolerance of hate speech against people like him that stopped short of calling for immediate violence. I would call that about as unbiased as one could get. I've never heard of any conservative columnist (e.g. W.F. Buckley, jr., Cal Thomas, Charles Krauthammer, Glenn Beck, Lou Dobbs, etc.) demanding that the federal government leave alone pacifists, environmentalists, liberals, journalists, whistleblowers, returning C.O. veterans, or ACLU lawyers.

You conservatives will never get it, will you? The ACLU and other free speech defenders defend YOUR right to say anything that doesn't lead to immediate violence, even if they don't like it, even if they are positively sickened by it, and they get nothing but criticism in return.

Re: The problem with hate speech

NMPollyTicks — Sat, 18 Oct 2008 00:38:40 -0000

Already the Secret Service has show that the comment "kiil him" wasn't used. The Secret Service has found no evidence of this. Of course comparing McCain/Palin to the people that firebombed the church in Birmingham isn't hate speech accounding to Price. Isn't it funny that if you disagree with Obama, you're a racist (see the complaint about the motel in Prince Georges County that displayed a McCain/Palin sign saying that it is racism to display a sign like that in a wealthy ethic neighborhood.) What about the 12 year old Florida girl who was called a racist for not backing Obama and instead backing McCain/Palin. You are correct T_J, Price will not drop the partisanship and try to correct the "hatred" show on BOTH sides. How sad.

Re: The problem with hate speech

Immanentize — Thu, 16 Oct 2008 13:00:51 -0000

Yeah, but only one party has made hate its core value. As I've posted elsewhere recently, I still don't see any substantial policy differences between the two major parties but I am reconsidering my refusal to vote for a Democrat or a Republican for president. I have always identified as a Conservative, but the fanatic hatred of the Republican Party scares me.

Re: The problem with hate speech

Thomas_James — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 18:45:33 -0000

Hate speech is not limited to one party V.B., you would have more credibility if you would drop the extreme partisanship. But I would hazard that when your real goal is spreading partisan propaganda that credibility doesn't really have much use.